my F#$%ing bad Night

EB_5.0_WAGON · 28-06-2005, 10:30 PM

my bad nite happened tonite when a stupid 19yr old female decided to stop in the middle of a road whilst making a left hand turn because a dog ran out in front of her.

I was following her but was about 15mtrs behind her on a wet road doing just under 60kmh. She was turning left into a side street so i slowed down. Next thing i know she is stationary in the middle of the road so i slam on the brakes and slide straight into her.

Needles to say im not a happy camper.

Nudge

dogbreath_48 · 28-06-2005, 10:37 PM

Dog woulda had a pretty rough night if the "stupid 19r old female" had run over it instead...

That is bad news though - hope it all pulls back together ok.

EB_5.0_WAGON · 28-06-2005, 10:39 PM

maybe the owner would learn to keep it on a lead next time ( it illegal to walk them without it in Brisbane)

EDManual · 28-06-2005, 10:58 PM

You were a bit close.

Annoying to have an "At Fault" claim, as you pay the excess and get a worse rating.
How much damage to her car?

Walkinshaw · 28-06-2005, 11:00 PM

very harsh comments to come but all in good faith

you were following too close, the accident is your fault.

Franky · 28-06-2005, 11:02 PM

I probably wouldn't hit the dog either, if it was wet it was probably a bit dangerous being so close.

LTD351 · 28-06-2005, 11:09 PM

that sucks, i'm fairly certain it is illegal to swerve for animals for that exact reason, it can cause accidents, because you were behind you would be at fault tho.

MITCHAY · 28-06-2005, 11:09 PM

I thought you werent meant to stop for animals unless of course they are huge. (ie cow) which you exactly wouldnt find anywhere in town. If i can stop safely i do but im not risking my life or anyone elses for an animal. Ive hit a bird and a cat both of which were unavoidable.

EB_5.0_WAGON · 28-06-2005, 11:11 PM

I was far enough back from her that had she not stopped dead in the middle of the road i wouldnt have even need to brake as she turned the corner. She was slowing down to turn and i was coasting(not accelerating or braking but still in 3rd gear) up the hill behind her.
Her car has paint off the spare tyre cover ( it was a Honda crv) some scratches on the plastic panel behind the spare wheel and it looks like the towbar is bent down slightly.

Mike Gayner · 29-06-2005, 04:54 AM

It sucks about the damage but the accident was your fault. What was she supposed to do, plough straight through the dog just so the guy behind her (who was clearly too close) didn't ram her? Sounds a little unfair. You should always have enough distance between yourself and the car in front so that you can stop short, no matter what.

merlin · 29-06-2005, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nudge

I was far enough back from her

Obviously not.

You should be anticipating random unexpected events to happen every time you get behind the wheel.

EA2BA · 29-06-2005, 08:34 AM

You are only supposed to stop for a dog if it safe to do so, well it wasnt was it as she caused an accident, so do not accept the blame for this, fight it all the way, she should pay for your car, dogs are to be on leads or in backyards, the law is on your side, ring the cops and you will find I am right.

merlin · 29-06-2005, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dellboy999

You are only supposed to stop for a dog if it safe to do so, well it wasnt was it as she caused an accident, so do not accept the blame for this, fight it all the way, she should pay for your car, dogs are to be on leads or in backyards, the law is on your side, ring the cops and you will find I am right.

It was safe for her to do so - its not her fault if some car was riding her **** in the wet and didnt keep a safe distance.

EA2BA · 29-06-2005, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merlin

It was safe for her to do so - its not her fault if some car was riding her **** in the wet and didnt keep a safe distance.

ring the cops tell them she stopped dead suddenly for a dog, and you could not avoid her so hit her, and see who is in the right, then tell me I am wrong.

merlin · 29-06-2005, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dellboy999

ring the cops tell them she stopped dead suddenly for a dog, and you could not avoid her so hit her, and see who is in the right, then tell me I am wrong.

You are correct in that in the road rules it states that you are not supposed to swerve/stop to avoid hitting an animal if unsafe to do so.

However from his account she was already braking to turn down a side street so its not like she came to a stop completley at random - so really he should have been ready anyway.

Combined with the fact that it is also a road rule to keep a safe distance from the car in front I reckon he would be in the wrong.

XAGSV8 · 29-06-2005, 09:22 AM

I thought any car the hits another up the bum is at fault no matter what because there has to be a safe distance keeped.

EA2BA · 29-06-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merlin

You are correct in that in the road rules it states that you are not supposed to swerve/stop to avoid hitting an animal if unsafe to do so.

However from his account she was already braking to turn down a side street so its not like she came to a stop completley at random - so really he should have been ready anyway.

Combined with the fact that it is also a road rule to keep a safe distance from the car in front I reckon he would be in the wrong.

OK, yes he could be, and is quite possibly in the wrong.

RED_EL_XR8 · 29-06-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merlin

Obviously not.

You should be anticipating random unexpected events to happen every time you get behind the wheel.

I concur !

EA2BA · 29-06-2005, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSWXA

I thought any car the hits another up the bum is at fault no matter what because there has to be a safe distance keeped.

Yes but if we all did that, then you need 2 car lengths at least, I had a car jump hard, really hard on the brakes because of a dog, due to this fact the police said its his fault, the law was on my side, I just left it at we both fix our cars and thats that, he argued I said phone the police and tell then the story, then tell me I am wrong, he never phoned back.

Cheech · 29-06-2005, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merlin

You are correct in that in the road rules it states that you are not supposed to swerve/stop to avoid hitting an animal if unsafe to do so.

However from his account she was already braking to turn down a side street so its not like she came to a stop completley at random - so really he should have been ready anyway.

Combined with the fact that it is also a road rule to keep a safe distance from the car in front I reckon he would be in the wrong.

Precisely......

Similar thing hapened to me 15 years ago when a guy in front stopped for a
TURTLE that was crossing the road on a wet day. Hydro planed straight into the back of him and Mr.Turtle disappeared into a storm drain. I was at fault and to top it of copped a neg driving fine as his vehicle had to be towed and we called the coppers. Was on my P's and had a $900 excess.
Learn't my lesson though.

bailey04 · 29-06-2005, 09:33 AM

Did she have her blinker on?

A question to everyone who said he was to close: If you see someone turning the corner do you slow right down and wait for them to go around the corner and maintain a safe distance until they are 30 meters around the corner before continuing? Most likely not, when someone turns off in front of you, you just keep driving along the road, you slow down so they can make it around the corner, and you pass within meters of the back of thier car. You don't sit back 30 metres down the road and wait for them to go round the corner do you?

So IMO it is fair to say that she was turning and you didn't anticipate her to stop dead, because most people don't corner without moving :eclipsee_ , and by the time you realised she had stopped it was to late? It has little to do with safe distance, and more to do with bad luck...

OLDFORDNUT · 29-06-2005, 09:39 AM

another thing is you should have steered around her if she was half way or more around the corner,the moment you jump on the brakes you lose control.

Heeno · 29-06-2005, 09:57 AM

if the dog was where its was ment to be...the house where it lives, this would not have happend in the first place, and it is illegal for a dog not to have a leech let alone to be roaming the streets anyway! im not going to comment on whos fault it was, I wasn't there and it could be as much her fault as it was yours, she could have swerved the dog and you could have swerved her!

RED_EL_XR8 · 29-06-2005, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bailey04

A question to everyone who said he was to close: If you see someone turning the corner do you slow right down and wait for them to go around the corner and maintain a safe distance until they are 30 meters around the corner before continuing? Most likely not, ...

No, but we should! The 30m is unecessary! The thing you learn is the more you burn the safty margin, the higher the level of anticipation you need to maintain. We often make a right turn in front of approaching cars with a left indicator one too. Ever seen someone aimlessly driving around with an indicator flashing.

And in both cases you strike the vehicle or the vehicle strikes you at a give way sign and you cop the ticket, push comes to shove and the other driver will generally deny an animal being involved , a faulty brake lamp, or an indicator left on.
Mr plod wont care he'll write the ticket and like it or not you were contributing to the accident. mightn't be fair but no-one ever promised fair.

Lucklily in this situation the other driver told the truth, and no-one was physically hurt.

Sourbastard · 29-06-2005, 10:10 AM

I used to work for PI who did insurance investigations. Anywhere forward of the rearmost pillar is "You are in the wrong" Territory according to the insurance industry. The only varying factor is the "percentage of wrongness" frmo there on in.

As its directly infront of you, according to the insurance industry, 100% liability for you.

bailey04 · 29-06-2005, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

We often make a right turn in front of approaching cars with a left indicator one too.....

....Lucklily in this situation the other driver told the truth, and no-one was physically hurt.

I have never seen a left blinker to turn right infront of traffic, and i rue the day when i do...

And yes it was lucky that the other driver did tell the truth..

geckoGT · 29-06-2005, 10:33 AM

It does not matter if she had her blinker on or not, nor does it matter that it was an animal. Pretend for a moment that it was a child running after a ball in front of you, would you run the kid down because someone might be behind you? If the answer is yes, get off the road now and hand your license in before you kill someone. In an emergency stop (no matter what reason), a driver is not expected to check the rear vision mirror to check that it is safe to stop. It is the responsibility of the person behind to ensure that they would be able to stop if the leading car has to carry out an emergency stop, no excuses. Just because you were not able to see what caused the emergency stop is no excuse, ever! Just imagine someone is driving along and suddenly feels crushing chest pain (heart attack) and suddenly throws out the anchor. You don't see any warning, just red brake lights and can't stop in time. Who is at fault? You are for following so close.
The golden rule is the moment you run nto the back of another car, you are too close and at fault. This also applies if you are stopped at a traffic light and a car hits you from behind, pushing you into the car in front of you. You are responsible for the car in front of you because you were too close to them. You are required by law to be a safe distance from the car in front of you with your foot on the brake at all times when stopped at traffic lights.
This is a subject that has been covered on every defensive and advanced driving course that I have done (about half a dozen now). On every course, the students had a terrible understanding of the law in this area at first (myself included on the first course).
Sometimes if the person who brakes hard in front of you did not have good reason (animal is good reason) the police may award a proportion of the blame on that person but you will be at least 50% responsible.

geckoGT · 29-06-2005, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dellboy999

Yes but if we all did that, then you need 2 car lengths at least, I had a car jump hard, really hard on the brakes because of a dog, due to this fact the police said its his fault, the law was on my side, I just left it at we both fix our cars and thats that, he argued I said phone the police and tell then the story, then tell me I am wrong, he never phoned back.

At least 2 car lengths, sorry too close. The guide is 2 seconds in dry conditions, double that in wet. so in the dry at 60km/h, the safe distance is 16m (about 5 car lengths) and 30m in the wet.
I really suggest that some people do defensive driving courses (should be government subsidised and compulsory befor getting off P's). Trust me, it will really open your eyes! Especially when you do the braking distance demonstration.

RED_EL_XR8 · 29-06-2005, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bailey04

I have never seen a left blinker to turn right infront of traffic, and i rue the day when i do...

And yes it was lucky that the other driver did tell the truth..

I have, I've been driving a long time and you never stop encoutering new amazements.

The situation I was actually referring to was when leaving a T intersection or private entryway look right, and the oncoming car has a left indicator on, safe to proceed? It should be but id numbnutz in the other car hasn't cancelled the indicator they will plow right into you when you proceed. And they will usually swear blind to roadside plod that the indicator wasn't on.

These are road skills, the anticipation of all the stupid things other can do, if we allow for those then all we have to worry about are our own inabilities..

Marlin_Girl · 29-06-2005, 10:44 AM

i agree with geckoxr8 on everything above!