Hopes rise of new XR8 - Page 3

Venomous1 · 18-04-2011, 07:26 PM

Just give a stock 307kw call it XR8 300 and make them send only one car to each dealer as a demo the rest you have to order. At least then people that really want one don't jump ship.

I waited so long for the new Xr8 that I went stuff it and bought a 2003 GT.

Good job Ford.

Smoke Pursuit · 18-04-2011, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venomous1

Just give a stock 307kw call it XR8 300 and make them send only one car to each dealer as a demo the rest you have to order. At least then people that really want one don't jump ship.

I waited so long for the new Xr8 that I went stuff it and bought a 2003 GT.

Good job Ford.

Why didnt you buy an FG XR8? Boss 290?

SteveJH · 18-04-2011, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venomous1

Just give a stock 307kw call it XR8 300 and make them send only one car to each dealer as a demo the rest you have to order. At least then people that really want one don't jump ship.

I waited so long for the new Xr8 that I went stuff it and bought a 2003 GT.

Good job Ford.

It wont have 307kw unless FG2 gets EPAS and a new ECU.

b0son · 18-04-2011, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveJH

In addition this is my opinion on Miami in an XR8 with regards to price.

XR8 will need to be in the ball park of where it was before, and more importantly, it will need to be in the ballpark of the SS.

Its pointless arguing about the cost of an aftermarket blower etc. You price the car to the market, not price the car to your cost. If Ford couldnt come up with a V8 that could compete against SS at a suitable pricepoint, thats their problem.

My guess, the GS gets dropped in the lead-up to the XR8, and the XR8 comes in sub $50k.

SteveJH · 18-04-2011, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

XR8 will need to be in the ball park of where it was before, and more importantly, it will need to be in the ballpark of the SS.

Its pointless arguing about the cost of an aftermarket blower etc. You price the car to the market, not price the car to your cost. If Ford couldnt come up with a V8 that could compete against SS at a suitable pricepoint, thats their problem.

My guess, the GS gets dropped in the lead-up to the XR8, and the XR8 comes in sub $50k.

Nope, what i'm saying is, if they want the xr8 to match the price of the xr6 turbo, it wont be Miami. Plus putting Miami into XR8 and pricing it at the XR6T pricing would mean you get an engine that tune only would outperform a stock $80,000 FPV GT-P, see a problem here?

Plus it'd probably lose them at least a few thousand per car.

Falcman0o7 · 18-04-2011, 07:59 PM

It's always the XR8 catching up with the SS, But if the XR8 comes back with the SC 5.0 it's going to be the SS trying to catch up with the XR8!
Really the XR8 should have it NA form like the stang.
Just do it ford. I know you want to

jpd80 · 18-04-2011, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falcman0o7

It's always the XR8 catching up with the SS, But if the XR8 comes back with the SC 5.0 it's going to be the SS trying to catch up with the XR8!

Just do it ford. I know you want to

what ever engine they pick must dominate the SS by a country mile so that even the most
imbecilic reviewer cannot help but give the win to the XR8, if Ford let that oher thing get
close by knobbling the S/C 5.0, then they deserve the shellacking they will undoubtedly get.

Having said that, if Ford sells between 150 and 200/mth of XR8 they would have done extremely well,
I just don't see the the good will out there converting into enough sales to be that relevant
to Ford's success or otherwise, an inspirational car yes but definitely not that much profit...

XRtowcar · 18-04-2011, 08:05 PM

Frustrating to see Ford fail to read their market again.
Not everyone buys an XR8 but it is an aspirational car that a lot of people like to associate they're car with.
Not having it is more damaging to the rest of the Falcon line up than the benfits of it by itself.
As for names, lets role back the names to the originals.
Falcon should be Mainline, G6E should be Customline, Focus should be Consul, and Fiesta, Anglia.

Perko · 18-04-2011, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

It has to be the SC 5.0... All they have to do is detune it, all the adr / crash / testing compliance is covered from what FPV have done.

Maybe in Series 2 they can make XR8 315, GS 330 and GT 351, would make sense to me.

Makes perfect sense. Can use existing manufacturing and components, is a marketing dream and puts a good break between the models. How can Ford go wrong with a combination like this? They'll find a way!

P6LTD351 · 18-04-2011, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRtowcar

Frustrating to see Ford fail to read their market again.
Not everyone buys an XR8 but it is an aspirational car that a lot of people like to associate they're car with.
Not having it is more damaging to the rest of the Falcon line up than the benfits of it by itself.
As for names, lets role back the names to the originals.
Falcon should be Mainline, G6E should be Customline, Focus should be Consul, and Fiesta, Anglia.

Correct. But Ford never understand this. Holden do. eg; Monaro 10 years ago

Road_Warrior · 18-04-2011, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRtowcar

As for names, lets role back the names to the originals.
Falcon should be Mainline, G6E should be Customline, Focus should be Consul, and Fiesta, Anglia.

Actually Customline is a name I threw around in the past when I suggested a new model to sit above the G6ET but fully loaded and with some front and rear styling differences...think of it as a Fairlane but without the LWB

Venomous1 · 18-04-2011, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Why didnt you buy an FG XR8? Boss 290?

amount of kit vs price. Plus the GT I found is mint.also 290.$30k.

Fordman · 18-04-2011, 09:39 PM

For a younger person like myself, wanting my first 8 banger an XR8 priced at the 46-50 mark would be perfect, GS really pushes me at 56k and seems to lack features.

phillyc · 18-04-2011, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ford Marketing

Almost one in four Commodores sold is fitted with a 6.0-litre V8 engine, with most of those the sportier SS and SS-V models that come with more overt styling.

Donovan says there is still a lucrative set of buyers who only want an affordable rear-drive V8 performance car, something Ford doesn't offer, instead relying on its XR6 Turbo that uses a six-cylinder.

''We've got to figure out what those customers want,'' she says. ''You've got to make sure it's going to be competitive and then you've got to target them, give them what they want.''

Quote:

Originally Posted by ebxr8240

Sheesh !! If they havn't WORKED it out by now ???
They NEVER will !!!!!

Some are thick. 1 in 4 Commodores are V8. Okay, the GMolden six has historically been poor by comparison. But, gee whiz. 1000 sales a month are V8 Commodore in sedan, wagon, ute.

Yet, Ford still DON'T know? Extra sales from a V8 will add economy / scale to the FG2 Falcon.

Put the N/A Coyote into XR8/G8E(Titanium) with 300kW/530Nm and line the prices up with the turbo. Add to that, shorter rear diff gears. eg 3.23/3.45 versus 2.73. Let the V8 engine use the revs as opposed to FI torque of the I6T.

jpd80 · 18-04-2011, 10:31 PM

Anyone hoping for a NA 5.0 from the Mustang certainly won't want a bar of the now troublesome Chinese made Getrag MT 82 Manual transmission, the posts on the Mustang website are piling up by the day, heart rendering stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ihad...eature=related

P6LTD351 · 18-04-2011, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Some are thick. 1 in 4 Commodores are V8. Okay, the GMolden six has historically been poor by comparison. But, gee whiz. 1000 sales a month are V8 Commodore in sedan, wagon, ute.

Yet, Ford still DON'T know? Extra sales from a V8 will add economy / scale to the FG2 Falcon.

Put the N/A Coyote into XR8/G8E(Titanium) with 300kW/530Nm and line the prices up with the turbo. Add to that, shorter rear diff gears. eg 3.23/3.45 versus 2.73. Let the V8 engine use the revs as opposed to FI torque of the I6T.

Yes, it is not rocket science, but Ford are doing their best to make us think it is.

phillyc · 18-04-2011, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eb2monty

Yes, it is not rocket science, but Ford are doing their best to make us think it is.

I know. Aargh. Far out just get it out there ASAP. When FG2 has the new ECU, the Coyote will work to it's full 4 VVT camshaft potential. No excuses from there on. Don't even care if it was auto or manual only at first with the other to come in reasonable time.

**Polyal** · 18-04-2011, 10:38 PM

Phillyc its ok, we have an awesome S/C engine that was build to suit ~1000 sales p.a...all is good

...Prodrive did a good job of getting that one past the accountants..."come on Ford..well go 51:49"...

Why on earth would Ford build a V8 car that would appeal to the masses? /end sarcasm

Time they looked back at history and stop repeating their mistakes.

**Polyal** · 18-04-2011, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

I know. Aargh. Far out just get it out there ASAP. When FG2 has the new ECU, the Coyote will work to it's full 4 VVT camshaft potential. No excuses from there on. Don't even care if it was auto or manual only at first with the other to come in reasonable time.

RE manual trans for coyote in a falcon, surely the T56 can be modded internally to suit if needed (bellhousing etc should fit off Miami), perhaps that would be more cost efficient that looking at using the mustang gbox aswell.

I never said it would be easy, its just not overly hard and the number potential is far greater than that of the Miami based cars.

I can hear whispers from Fords marketing guys now.."falcon with the heart of a mustang"...

phillyc · 18-04-2011, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

RE manual trans for coyote in a falcon, surely the T56 can be modded internally to suit if needed, perhaps that would be more cost efficient that looking at using the mustang gbox aswell.

I never said it would be easy, its just not overly hard and the number potential is far greater than that of the Miami based cars.

Mate, agreed. Not overly hard. Heck, they can engineer entire cars. The reason I suggested auto first is that is where the sales are. G8E would be auto only anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

I can hear whispers from Fords marketing guys now.."falcon with the heart of a mustang"...

Love it. But, do Ford Australia marketing know what Mustang is and the synergy / history with Falcon? Probably not.

**Polyal** · 18-04-2011, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phillyc

Mate, agreed. Not overly hard. Heck, they can engineer entire cars. The reason I suggested auto first is that is where the sales are. G8E would be auto only anyway.
Love it. But, do Ford Australia marketing know what Mustang is and the synergy / history with Falcon? Probably not.

Yes mention XR to a current marketing guy/gal and they will only ever think XR6....tickford might come into it if your lucky...none of them would know about the XR Falcon, and the fact that the GT used the then mustang engine...

CHRIST WE EVEN HAVE SUNBURST AS A COLOUR WHICH IS CLOSE ENOUGH TO THE XR GT GOLD.....

But yeah..cant help sitting here think what a nice all round car it would be.

Dear FoA, please have this car in atleast concept form for the next motorshow, get a current 2011 mustang GT over for shytes and giggles and have it next to the coyote XR8 on the stand, bonnets up...that should do it.

b0son · 18-04-2011, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveJH

Nope, what i'm saying is, if they want the xr8 to match the price of the xr6 turbo, it wont be Miami.

The XR6T's price needs to be looked at too TBH.... it used to be a modest price jump from a regular XR6. Given the sorts of discounts dealers are having to offer to move them, I would suggest buyers are beginning to think the same.

Quote:

Plus putting Miami into XR8 and pricing it at the XR6T pricing would mean you get an engine that tune only would outperform a stock $80,000 FPV GT-P, see a problem here?

Like the XR6T? Besides, most dont tune theirs, so probably not really relevant.

SteveJH · 18-04-2011, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

The XR6T's price needs to be looked at too TBH.... it used to be a modest price jump from a regular XR6. Given the sorts of discounts dealers are having to offer to move them, I would suggest buyers are beginning to think the same.

Or add more features, aka. FG2.

Quote:

Like the XR6T? Besides, most dont tune theirs, so probably not really relevant.

The FG xr6t makes 330rwkw+ tune only? (stock GT) Or does it make 380rwkw+? (tuned GT/GS)

davenl5l · 18-04-2011, 11:48 PM

they cant go back to using the ghia name because like everything else good ford had they sold the name !

b0son · 18-04-2011, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveJH

Or add more features, aka. FG2.

It would need an awful lot more features to be the performance bargain it once was.

Quote:

The FG xr6t makes 330rwkw+ tune only?

The GT even makes 330rwkw+ in the first place? I thought that was at the flywheel?

SteveJH · 18-04-2011, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

It would need an awful lot more features to be the performance bargain it once was.

Except there are quite a few people on here who have been making it quite clear the xr6t/xr8 cost roughly the same amount now (or less) then they were at the release of BA, with inflation, that makes them a bargain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

The GT even makes 330rwkw+ in the first place? I thought that was at the flywheel?

Aparrently. Check some of the threads in Coyote section. Might have to go back a few pages though.

Edit: Here is a GS dyno thread. First post has a stock power number, on the last page is a tune only figure from another car.

**Polyal** · 19-04-2011, 12:11 AM

The pricing argument was centered on Ford "having" to have the Xr8 the same as the XR6T because they were not moving them, for various reasons, initially the XR8 carried a premium; which it should as its development will cost more than the XR6T.

Also for brand positioning the XR8 is the top Ford, so the price should reflect that. Pre BOSS260/290 XR8 the car always carried a larger cost.

mik · 19-04-2011, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

It may be the base V8, but for 45-50 odd grand it should be more than basic!! Just my opinion of course!!

my s2 au xr6 with some options was 45k 10 years ago, from my perspective its hard to see ford aus putting much more into the higher spec 2011 model at that price, 45/50k seems a fair wack, but at the same time 45k is worth bugger all these days compared to 20 years ago imo, and compared to my s2 , the 2011 falc already has 6 speed ,more safety stuff in it, the hero engine, you see where where i`m coming from?

Gobes32 · 19-04-2011, 04:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rancidpunx

I did a job for a older fella who had one of the last BF Fairmonts. He told me they (with his wife) bought a G6E and sold it within 2 months purely because it was not a Fairmont. So they bought the BF instead. .

That is the single most stupidest thing I have heard in my life. Seriously.

This person actually sold a car because the badge was different?

rancidpunx · 19-04-2011, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobes32

That is the single most stupidest thing I have heard in my life. Seriously.

This person actually sold a car because the badge was different?

lol I had to make sure they had actually got an FG. But yes they sold their G6E because it wasn't a fairmont and went out to buy a BF with low Kays. This was back in 08 when the FG was first released. The guy said it drove fine and the features were to be expected but it just wasnt what they wanted.