How multicultural is Holden?

Shonky · 10-08-2005, 11:51 AM

Holden supporters like to claim that the commodore is the true Australian car... Just wondering, How many different countries are involved in the manufacture of any given example of the general's finest?

This should be interesting...

The MaDDeSTMaN · 10-08-2005, 12:11 PM

I think that the most "australian" cars are actually Mitsubishis, manufactured in Adelaide, although I could be wrong...

Sourbastard · 10-08-2005, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The MaDDeSTMaN

I think that the most "australian" cars are actually Mitsubishis, manufactured in Adelaide, although I could be wrong...

Yeah thanks blame us for that.

SunDrifter · 10-08-2005, 12:30 PM

I've argued this for years... Not that it will ever change any comodedoor owners opinion of his/her fine "Australian" car.

I was watching deal or no deal the other day (i know, i know) and a bloke that was on the show was craping on about wanting to buy a clubbedsport. When the host prompted him about the car on the show, he returned some response about not liking european cars!

What a dumbass! Never heard of Opel then?

<edit> I thought mitsus' were about on par for being Aussie made with the Falcons?

Shonky · 10-08-2005, 12:55 PM

The only true Australian vehicle is the mighty Oka.

Beasty MoFos... but bloody expensive!

Heeno · 10-08-2005, 01:08 PM

well really neither are ford, don't quote me on this but isn't henry ford an american or british or something like that?? im not sure if there is an all aussie car owned, foundered and manufactured by an aussie. hmmm could be wrong (most probably am) but it would be good to clear this up

The MaDDeSTMaN · 10-08-2005, 01:17 PM

I think the point of this thread is how much of the Commodore is imported and simply assembled here, as opposed to made AND assembled here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Young 'un

Holden supporters like to claim that the commodore is the true Australian car... Just wondering, How many different countries are involved in the manufacture of any given example of the general's finest?

This should be interesting...

All I'm sure of is that none of the engines used in any Commodores are manufactured here, they're all imported from the US. I'm sure there are other bits and pieces that arrive in a shipping container rather then providing aussies with jobs, but I'm not sure what else...

OzJavelin · 10-08-2005, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heeno

well really neither are ford, don't quote me on this but isn't henry ford an american or british or something like that?? im not sure if there is an all aussie car owned, foundered and manufactured by an aussie. hmmm could be wrong (most probably am) but it would be good to clear this up

Umm .. I'm not sure if that is a joke or not? Henry Ford (and Family) were Americans ..

Like GMH I'd assume any profit Ford Australia makes as a decent percentage of it shipped back to the good 'ole US-of-A. Holden was a body-maker (primarily for GM) many, many years ago which GM purchased outright and used the name to build an "Australian" car. Well .. actually pretty much hand-me-down American body, engine, drivetrain, etc. But Holden battled along with American-like bodies/mechanicals. Chrysler and Ford did a similar thing in the early sixties where they built cars that "looked" like American versions, but used fully American-designed engines. I would estimate that during these times Holden built the "Australian-car" tag which only stuck more during the Kingswood era of the Seventies ..

MITCHAY · 10-08-2005, 01:59 PM

Commodores and falcons are australia built cars. Lets see the Holden marque is unique to Australia and New Zealand. Ford is not. The alloytec engines i think are made here. It depends what you classify as truly Australian.

Does it mean all components are made and assembled here or does it mean that they are built here. I doubt the first is true for either.

Would anyone rather their cars to be more expensive just to have the Australian Made logo on it?

Steffo · 10-08-2005, 01:59 PM

Commodore? Well.. lets see...

Body = Germany, Opel Omega, stretched and slightly re-styled by Holden

V8 = Chevrolet GenIII LS1 and Chevrolet GenIV LS2, imported

3.6 V6 = Made Here, designed in USA

Five-Speed Auto (5L40E) = Imported

Four-Speed Auto's (4L60E & 4L65E) = Imported

6-Speed Manuals (Aisin for SV6 and T56 for the rest) = Imported

5-Speed Manuals (Getrag, in the base utes and such) = Imported

Falcon is just a tad more Aussie...

Body = Designed and Made here

V8 = Imported block, and other bits and pieces, then assembled here

4.0 6cyl = Designed and Made here

Four-Speed Auto's (BTR M97LE) = made here

5-Speed Manual's (T5) = Not sure? Imported I think

6-Speed Manual's (T56) = Imported

I don't think there's been an entirely Aussie designed and made car since the Holden 48/215. And there probably never will be, always going to have foreign bits in them. Falcon is about as close as it gets.

Shonky · 10-08-2005, 02:21 PM

Cheers Steffo... Thats what I was after.

I am not saying that Fords are more Australian than Holden, it's just that a lot of Holden fans, especially ones who don't actually know anything about cars regularly state that they support Holden because it's an Aussie car.

BTW. Okas are designed and built in Australia, using Aussie components where available and the company is 100% Australian owned. This probably explains the massive price tag.

Cheahman · 10-08-2005, 03:05 PM

heres some pics of the opel omega

MITCHAY · 10-08-2005, 03:13 PM

I reckon that looks like a nice car. Id have one.

XD-Machine · 10-08-2005, 03:53 PM

i got to say the kingswood is one of the nicest holden's built, it does give off a Aussie car kind of attitude

The Dok · 10-08-2005, 04:20 PM

: Ok my 2c worth:
Headlights/taillights/bodylights=Sth Korea since@1994
Interior trim (some) + doortrims=India

Perana · 10-08-2005, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffo

I don't think there's been an entirely Aussie designed and made car since the Holden 48/215.

Even that wasnt a true aussie car....

SB076 · 10-08-2005, 05:36 PM

Commodores and all there variants incl utes, crewmans etc are all manufacture in Adelaide as is the Mitsubishi Magna, Toyota Camrys, Ford Falcons and Territorys are manufactured in Vic. However as Steffo has pointed out a lot of the components are manufactured overseas and bought into the country. From what I have heard (don't know how accurate this is) but 70% of the VE Commodore will come from overseas. A lot of suppliers to the Automotive industry are looking at moving manufacturing offshore or they are losing contracts overseas ie Pilkington and Autoliv (manufacturer windrscreens, windows and Autoliv manufacture seat belts etc) There has been others I think Natra (radiators) but there has been a fair bit about it recently in the press.

XD-Machine · 10-08-2005, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SB076

Commodores and all there variants incl utes, crewmans etc are all manufacture in Adelaide as is the Mitsubishi Magna, Toyota Camrys, Ford Falcons and Territorys are manufactured in Vic. However as Steffo has pointed out a lot of the components are manufactured overseas and bought into the country. From what I have heard (don't know how accurate this is) but 70% of the VE Commodore will come from overseas. A lot of suppliers to the Automotive industry are looking at moving manufacturing offshore or they are losing contracts overseas ie Pilkington and Autoliv (manufacturer windrscreens, windows and Autoliv manufacture seat belts etc) There has been others I think Natra (radiators) but there has been a fair bit about it recently in the press.

i am sick of it. dam asian counties paying ppl like 2 dollars a day to work. how can any aussie company keep up with that. i would personaly pay more if every think cost more cause it would just be normal then. business say if you want it cheap we must go overseas but thats stupid cause we are just ruining ourselfs because we are influecing more and more slave labour companies to start up. one day there labour is going to go up and everythink will cost heaps why not just start now and give ppl jobs.

Sourbastard · 10-08-2005, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XD-Machine

i am sick of it. dam asian counties paying ppl like 2 dollars a day to work. how can any aussie company keep up with that. i would personaly pay more if every think cost more cause it would just be normal then. business say if you want it cheap we must go overseas but thats stupid cause we are just ruining ourselfs because we are influecing more and more slave labour companies to start up. one day there labour is going to go up and everythink will cost heaps why not just start now and give ppl jobs.

And which Aussie company would that be. Would that be the US Owned Ford? The Japenese owned Toyota? The US Owned Holden perhaps? After all they mean a great deal to Australia. The car industry is multinational, so is the parts supply that runs it. We export Holdens to the Middle East. Maybe they should stop buying our cars because we are nothing more then cheap filthy foreigners?

RED_EL_XR8 · 10-08-2005, 10:15 PM

There were several plans to build the all Aussie car the "Austral Apathetic", but no-one ever got around to it.

It was to feature a winny-blue dispenser, 7.1 sound hard wired to only play John Williamson tunes, a corrugated iron finish, and it would not even start until the driver's BAC had reached double figures.

Gammaboy · 10-08-2005, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sourbastard

Maybe they should stop buying our cars because we are nothing more then cheap filthy foreigners?

Hey! I had a shower today, and I'm definitly not cheap!

MO · 10-08-2005, 10:27 PM

The Whippet...bring back the Whippet damn it,it really was an Oz car.

Kapn_Kiwi · 10-08-2005, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

There were several plans to build the all Aussie car the "Austral Apathetic", but no-one ever got around to it.

It was to feature a winny-blue dispenser, 7.1 sound hard wired to only play John Williamson tunes, a corrugated iron finish, and it would not even start until the driver's BAC had reached double figures.

Kinda like... this?

RED_EL_XR8 · 10-08-2005, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skinny_Puppy

Kinda like... this?

Wooden car, with wooden wheels and a wooden engine, NZ automotive industry was really onto something! Problem was when it came to demo it to the world the darn thing wooden start!!
(sic! I know, ........ I think its time for my lie down now.)

Gammaboy · 10-08-2005, 10:33 PM

SHouldn't it be all covered in sheepskin if it was made in NZ?

MO · 10-08-2005, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8
[SIZE=1

(sic! I know, ........ I think its time for my lie down now.) [/SIZE]

And don't forget your valium or serapax,if you've run out you can have some of mine.

12 · 11-08-2005, 12:22 AM

Fact = The first and only Commodore to be designed.. AND built in Australia will be the next (2006/VE?) Commodore. It will be the first ground up true "Aussie" Commodore ever. No Commodore to date has ever been a fully designed and built.. and unique to Australia only vehicle. I'm not talking of supply parts here.. (hell.. the tooling for the next Commonwhore shell and panels was done in Japan!), but of the fully designed and built aspect.

The Falcon on the other hand, has been a true Australian designed and built car for years.. over 25 years if I'm not mistaken.

Steffo · 11-08-2005, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 012

Fact = The first and only Commodore to be designed.. AND built in Australia will be the next (2006/VE?) Commodore. It will be the first ground up true "Aussie" Commodore ever. No Commodore to date has ever been a fully designed and built.. and unique to Australia only vehicle. I'm not talking of supply parts here.. (hell.. the tooling for the next Commonwhore shell and panels was done in Japan!), but of the fully designed and built aspect.

The Falcon on the other hand, has been a true Australian designed and built car for years.. over 25 years if I'm not mistaken.

Since the XA made its debut in 1972. 33 years and counting.

mik · 11-08-2005, 12:49 AM

i think the first registered holden off the production line in oz was actually registered as a chevrolet, fj or fx i forget which come first, and without a doubt 6 cyl falcon has more parts made in australia ,

montyv8 · 11-08-2005, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skinny_Puppy

that kingswood is covered in corrugated iron, not wood.....